Unnatural Aggro

[Hordak]

Ok everyone knows what this deck is I'm sure, but here's a version that in no way, shape, or form, uses Schproing.

2 Obsession
13 Elitism

4 Contriving Engineer
4 T Force 5 Megabrutemajig
4 T Force 5 Megascoutmajig
4 Guard Force Alpha Prime H4xor
4 633fy 31f
4 Ominous Oozling
4 Servile Centipede

4 Unnatural Alteration
4 Quotidian Disappearance
4 1337!
4 Air Travel
4 Exploding Sock Puppet
4 Voidal Interference
4 Obsessive Compulsion
4 Precise Sabotage

I recently switched in the Alpha Prime H4xor for Morphmajig as I prefer the perm 4/4/3 and the perm resource advantage he can net you. The basic idea, for those that haven't played this type of deck, is gaining permanent resource advantage over your opponent with the guard force and the contriving engineer. Optimal first couple turns look like:

Elitism, 1337!, Contriving, go

Elitism, Unnatural Alteration -> T Force 5, 633fy, go

etc.

[Fist of Gales]

Interesting idea. I like the inclusion of the T Force 5 guys with the Alteration, that is something I havent seen before. Looks like you must be starting 2 obsession and running 13 elitism in deck? Not alot of room in this deck for other stuff, but I suprised that you dont have assassination in here. What do you think about Manifold in here? I like the Megascout, but he can only trade with martial artist or swashbuckler and he is vulnerable to imbeccible timing. I like the concept alot though, I definitely think that schproing is overated, really on of the things I like best about him is that he can sac off guys your opponet tries to steal and with the bounce in here that isnt as big of a deal. Seems like you might have some issues in games that you dont draw an early contriving though.

Really cool deck.

[Hordak]

I'm thinking about replacing Scout with something else, but basically my 7-cost slot is the toolbox slot. Do I need a beefy slow hitter? I faster, weaker guy? or maybe just a covert to put the game on a clock? I tend to mulligan super-aggressively to avoid the no-contriving hand. You're correct on the resource count...I'll edit to include that. Manifold doesn't fill a niche for me that isn't already filled. The fact that Brute is is 2 speed makes him better for my purposes because 633fy's and Alpha Prime's pave the way for him.

As for Disappearance that may be going away as well. The deck is in a transitional phase. It had the Insect Appreciator + Spiky Atlasphere combo in it to guarantee pushing damage through, but I wasn't getting as much use out of it as I wanted. I also had morphmajigs in here so the disappearance worked 2 fold and is cheaper than Assassination. It can also bounce anything and with the proper board paring you can force them to choose their own MA, Assimilation Center, whatever.

I appreciate the input as there are still a couple of outstanding replacements that I wanted to make.

[thegnomishone]

I'd love to see this run Shipping containers. A lot of decks can't handle the token swarm, and those that can handle it often can't handle the 4/5/3 container itself

[Hordak]

That's what came to mind as a T Force Scout replacement actually. I preferred to ask the question in a vacuum and see if any of my thoughts were echoed by others independently :)

I'm also unsure about the Serviles to be honest...they might get replaced with Millipedes. Finding the tactics isn't a problem, recurring them is.

[thegnomishone]

If you're worried about recursion, replace the Air Travels with Remembers. I might also suggest losing disappearances for Ejectors or Assassinations. The millipede is too slow, but the Centipede lets you search a tactic and then destroy him to hunt down your 7 coster. The other card that would probably work well here if you can find room is a 2-of Violating Anomaly. Lose 1 Sock Puppet and 1 Sabotage, and you have a very solid character (at 2/4/2) that can absolutely wreck your opponent's board position and hand.

[Hordak]

Air Travel can usually = free damage + cycles so that's probably staying.

If I replace Disappearance with Ejector then it would justify Violating, other wise Violating would have to stay out. Violating is also more of a control card and I'm looking to smash heads in. Precise Sabotage is just too valuable to compromise. You, being a fellow Colorado player, know that failing to have an answer to a turn 2 goliath, or a mercenary's creed can be fatal. I like millipede more than centipede because the millipede can put in some damage before you need/want to cycle him into something more useful. I also find greater use in reusing a tactic than going to find a new one. It can also throw off people's math on the likelyhood of you having X tactics in your deck/hand based on how many you played.

This is good discussion btw, and I'm not dismissing anyone's ideas, just discussing my own reasoning :)

[Fist of Gales]

Do you think that you need 4 ofs on all of your large characters? Really you dont want to draw them that often, what do you think about maybe sliding down to 3 or 2 on some of them? Potentially you could do a larger mix of characters in the 6-7 cost range, adding in some that might be better in a particular matchup.

I'd definitely prefer assassination in here over dissaperance personally. I'm not hating on disapperance or anything I play it in a few of my own decks. It just seems like it is a hold over from your old version that had morphmajig in it. Ejector might be good, if you add in some 6 cost guys like shipping container or anomaly (who are both fine targets for alteration themselves in the right situation).

I like the idea of remember or millipede in here, you have alot of tactics that are pretty important to your strategy. Personally I'd probably keep the serville and then maybe lower my air travels by one or two. Alternatively you could maybe go with like forget or some other bounce in place of the air travel, seems like that would often be as effective at getting damage through.

[Hordak]

The reasoning behind 4 ofs is I want those characters in play, regardless of how they got there :) I could certainly shift this to more of a toolbox deck centered around Unnatural Alteration, but that would take the aggressive bite out of it (is my fear). By turn 3 if things went well (ie. I got a contriving engineer at any point) I'll be able to lay down a 7 cost dude every turn with a little help from 1337!. I think I'll reevaluate some of the cards in the deck and repost what I come up with from your guys's suggestions.

[thegnomishone]

I think that Alterationing a Toolbox w/ a prototype into a violating Anomaly or a shipping container would be ridiculously hot, personally.

[Hordak]

Updated List

2 Obsession
13 Elitism

4 Contriving Engineer
3 T Force 5 Megabrutemajig
3 MSC
3 Guard Force Alpha Prime H4xor
4 633fy 31f
3 Ejector
3 Schproing
3 Rummaging Millipede
3 700lb0x 31f

3 Luteoderm Prototype
4 Unnatural Alteration
3 Quotidian Assassination
4 1337!
3 Air Travel
3 Exploding Sock Puppet
4 Voidal Interference
3 Obsessive Compulsion
3 Precise Sabotage


Update on this. Many 3ofs. Anything that there are 4 of are only because the effect of those cards is irreplaceable. I added in Schproings, MSCs, Rummaging Millipede, 700lb0x, prototype, QA, and ejector. I opted against Violating Anomoly because I still feel that it's a control style card in an aggro style deck. I really liked the 7-cost slot toolbox as it was perfect for both contriving and servile, but I think the 6 cost will work better in the long run. Also, I kept Air Travel because I still think it's an awesome card for pushing damage through.

[Fist of Gales]

No serviles anymore? I was with you on having say 2-3 air travels when you had servile to search for it, but I dont really like it in there without them.

[Hordak]

Rummaging versus Servile...battle of the bugs. I may try it with both, but for now where you read "...ipede" read it as interchangable :)

[thegnomishone]

I still think that Servile > Rummaging and that Remember > Air travel in that deck. 1337 into Servile for an Alteration first turn is stupidly good. If you had something that cost 8 that you wanted to alter the millipede into, that's one thing, but he's really just not worth it.

[Hordak]

That's not stupidly good because it's not the best first turn play in the game :)

Rummaging provides the following advantanges over Servile:
3/1/3 Covert vs 1/3/3
recurs a tactic which can throw off opponent's math on how many you have

advantages for Servile:
Access to any one tactic from your deck rather than reusing one
1 cheaper


Oh and Air Travel > Remember. Air Travel = damage, Remember = ?, Phase 3 = profit.

[thegnomishone]

Damned underpants Gnomes. And out of curiosity, what, in your opinion, IS the best first turn play in the game? Erotic, Erotic, Erotic, Erotic, 1337, Contriving?

[Hordak]

1337! -> Contriving is the best first turn play in the game. Doesn't really matter what else you throw in there.

[LucienofShadow]

Hmm... I like this deck. However, I must say that Servile Centipede should be in it. I see no reason why we can't run both it and it's covert brethren. Does that drive the deck a little to the control side? Maybe, but Millipede can be very aggressive even if Centipede isn't. In my mind what you should do is look at every Centipede you draw as a 7 drop in play. Because in the next turn or so, it will be.

[Hordak]

It's gotta be one or the other. There's simply nothing else to cut. In the end I think it's gonna be centipedes because of the alteration potential.

[LucienofShadow]

Of course there's something else to cut. I'm going to try and keep your design in mind here and not force in some of my deck building concepts, but looking at the card we'll be adding, we can make the tactics more toolboxy.

-Precise Sabotage
-2 Voidal Interference (I see this card as highly situational)

+3 Servile

tada. You could also toolboxitize your character line-up, do away with toolbox elf/lutoderm, or any number of other things.

[Hordak]

Of course there's something else to cut. I'm going to try and keep your design in mind here and not force in some of my deck building concepts, but looking at the card we'll be adding, we can make the tactics more toolboxy.

-Precise Sabotage
-2 Voidal Interference (I see this card as highly situational)

+3 Servile

tada. You could also toolboxitize your character line-up, do away with toolbox elf/lutoderm, or any number of other things.

Ok so I mispoke :p

Precise Sabotage is a must around here...too much item based annoyance (meta specific choice). The Voidals...nah, this card is godlike. I also like the 7001b0x because he auto-tutors into anything while thinning the deck, costs one less, and can still alter into a MSC or Schproing.

That said, Servile will probably trump Rummaging.

[LucienofShadow]

Alright, I wasn't going to touch them originally, but you can take out Obsessive Compulsion. Yes they're good. But searching for the tactic (lit. card) of your choice is better. The problem with that is that before they were helping you with your 633fy 31v35. It might actually be a good idea to drop one of them, godly as they are.

[thegnomishone]

Turn. Zero...

That's all I really have to say about Obsessive Compulsion... Turn Zero. Oh, and also: Have that pesky one resource left over that you can't do anything with? Get a little OCD ^_^

[Hordak]

I also think that in an aggro centric deck it's irreplaceable to be able to pick my next couple of draws...makes the 3 I pay more meaningful. Just some thoughts :p I dont need the recycle that badly.

[Redwithrage]

i think you need another obsession to play ozzling

hey hey but im no judge ?

[s0b3k]

hey hey but im no judge ?

thats true... oozling requires 2 obsession to play... just like the deck has

[Redwithrage]

wow im an ass ... ill go get back in my hole and die !


sorry :-(

[Falsesanity]

I just wanted to chime in on best 1st turn plays


1337! Senior beefy pogo pogo pogo pogo....

turn 2 senior tap dual seniors into seinor into beefy

turn 3 and beyond... smash faces!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[s0b3k]

I just wanted to chime in on best 1st turn plays


1337! Senior beefy pogo pogo pogo pogo....

turn 2 senior tap dual seniors into seinor into beefy

turn 3 and beyond... smash faces!!!!!!!!!!!!!


4 pogo's first turn is not that great... hold them until turn 2 so you can acually activate them :P

[thegnomishone]

Turn 1: Erotic, Erotic, Erotic, Erotic, Snooty Doorman.

[Hordak]

Turn 1: Erotic, Erotic, Erotic, Erotic, Snooty Doorman.

Followed by Turn 0 - Distract, Distract, Distract, Distract, Target Practice

[s0b3k]

Turn 1: Erotic, Erotic, Erotic, Erotic, Snooty Doorman.
you should 1337 out the doorman just cause it is more fun!

[infidel07]

u should put nodes in. just five. 4 basic and a hub. it looks like ur version is weak against node rush.i also like it for beefy.u dont have any kill to deal with nodes so if u can kill 'em, play 'em.

[Tanis143]

u should put nodes in. just five. 4 basic and a hub. it looks like ur version is weak against node rush.i also like it for beefy.u dont have any kill to deal with nodes so if u can kill 'em, play 'em.


That all depends. He has the chance to get out many big characters before the node field would be built, so the node controller would either have to accept a lot of damage first or sac his node field. The only real danger would be hidden sandwiches (a must in any node build). If he needs any nodes I would put 3-4 basic nodes in, no need for a hub node. Just play a basic and sac to schproing, boom instant node field clearing (done this many times with my own elite deck hehe).

[J Caster]

That all depends. He has the chance to get out many big characters before the node field would be built, so the node controller would either have to accept a lot of damage first or sac his node field. The only real danger would be hidden sandwiches (a must in any node build). If he needs any nodes I would put 3-4 basic nodes in, no need for a hub node.

Just play a basic and sac to schproing, boom instant node field clearing (done this many times with my own elite deck hehe).


Unless he plays one of those "(a must in any node build)" sandwiches you mentioned on your saced basic.....

[Anders Møller]

But if he plays the sandwich on your node, can't you just sac it again afterwards... ? Maybe it's obvious, maybe I'm stupid.

Subquestion: If you sandwich the creature you sac, does the schproing still become unblockable?

Anders

[J Caster]

yes he can :)

[Tanis143]

You can could always re-sac it to the schproing after the sandwich is played. Hince:

Player 1: I'll play a basic node, then sac to Schproing.
Player 2: I'll play hidden sandwich on your basic.
Hidden sandwich is destroyed, node stays in play.
Player 1 ends turn
Player 1: At the start of your turn I'll sac the basic to the schproing

So, unless the person has two sandwiches, trying to stop player 1 from sac'ing to the schproing is almost pointless.

[Lioge]

Unless he plays one of those "(a must in any node build)" sandwiches you mentioned on your saced basic.....

Sorry, this won't work.


Schproing!
cost: Destroy a character you control.
effect: This turn, while this card is the only member of an attacking party it cannot be blocked.

The destroy is part of the cost of the ability. You can't respond to someone paying costs. That is one dead node.

[J Caster]

Sorry, this won't work.



The destroy is part of the cost of the ability. You can't respond to someone paying costs. That is one dead node.



--unless the sandwich was already attached (but yeah.......:o )

[Matthera184]

Originally Posted by: tanis143

Player 1: I'll play a basic node, then sac to Schproing.
Player 2: I'll play hidden sandwich on your basic.
Hidden sandwich is destroyed, node stays in play.
Player 1 ends turn
Player 1: At the start of your turn I'll sac the basic to the schproing

So, unless the person has two sandwiches, trying to stop player 1 from sac'ing to the schproing is almost pointless.

Regardless of not being able to play the hidden sandwich in response to sac-ing the node, you could just sac the basic node on the same turn again. You're allowed to use abilities as many times as you're able to. So even if the person had 2 sandwiches, it's still pointless to try to stop it.

Plus, you're not able to respond to your opponent's beginning of the turn triggers. You'd have to wait until they attacked, played a card, used an ability on one of their cards, or ended their turn in order to respond with the Sproing.

In concluion, n0d3z FTW.

[Tanis143]

Ok, enough about nodes, we know they are annoying and also pretty easy to get around (almost like Schproing/MSC). Just wondering how Hordak is doing with the deck.

[Hordak]

I like it quite a bit. I've played it (and played against it) with several kinds of decks and it hasn't lost yet. It feels more toolbox-like than its older version, but I've been able to live with that. You guys will probably see it at the invitationals. Oh noez, I just gave away my secret leet tech.

[Anders Møller]

And now you're done for mr. H. :P

I've been playing a similar build for quite some time (I run violating anomaly as well though) and I find it to perform really well...

-Anders

[Hordak]

I thought about anomoly, but it's not quite "smashy" enough. The effect is strong, but I have better aggro cards to fish out IMO.

As for giving away my invitational strat...eh, I think I'll be alright :) Nobody from my area reads these boards I'm sure.

[D3501473_1]

why doesn't anybody ever run spastic tentacles...

turn 1 - tentacles

turn 2 - attack -> another tentacles (-2)

turn 3 - attack -> another tentacles (-4)

turn 4 - attack -> ANOTHER tentacles (-6)

turn 5 - attack -> do something less stupid (-8)

if you go first and happen to draw all 4 tentacles, that's 20 damage before they can even play a character or draw, unless they are playing small characters in which case SMASH THEM hahaha you likey?

[Hordak]

I've actually been working on a way to abuse that guy...stop giving away my tech.

[Anders Møller]

As for the anomaly, I usually fish him out when I'm a bit more on my heels. I just think it's nice to have something else than a hardcore beatstick to dish out with all the tricks... In short: It's good for variety. :p
With that said I run a slightly more control-based build rather than the aggro-build. I guess it all comes down to preference...

It looks like someone has gained acces to your secret vault of techs... How about the garbageman/misappropriation device/hollow moose/cutpurse/pickpocket-tech? Is that one coming from there as well? :p

Anders

[Hordak]

That deck already exists, and is owned by a buddy of mine with whom I play on a semi-regular basis...get out of my head!